[Wares]

[Mox]

THIS TOPIC IS MEANT FOR EVERYTHING RELATING TO WARES IN THE BSG MOD

[Nicholas]

Just thought I'd add all the things I think can classify as wares in BSG.

Ore
Possibly more than one type of ore required for different products. (perhaps tillium for fuel, uranium for more nukes and something else for viper construction)

Food
An obvious one, but not sure if this can be produced on any ships or not. It seems that the only mention is when Baltar gives a statement about it's rate of consumption. Though given that none of the ships would really be stocked up with food they must be producing it somewhere.

Water
This, as seen in the first series is something that must be found. It cannot be produced by any ships, however Galactica has a huge supply compared to all the other ships, and never runs out. Meanwhile different ships run out at different rates.

Viper/Raptor Pilots
Can be trained on Galactica and pegasus, but at a slow rate and in a batch process.

Pilots
In order for civilian and military ships to be piloted. Minimum of 3 per ship, as shifts will be needed. Can be trained from civilians anywhere.

Officers
Required on millitary ships. Probably pointless to do individual ranks, and also I can't think how they would be used in the game. Since all they do is tell others what to do. Perhaps a number of them are required to operate Galactica's weapons. Can be trained from civilians aboard galactica or pegasus.

Engineers/Deck crew (Knuckle Draggers)
Required to repair all ships hulls and also damaged vipers and raptors. The more you have the faster the repairs get done. Can be trained from civilians anywhere.

Marines
To prevent cylon boarding parties from taking control of ship. Can be trained from civilians aboard galactica.

Civilians
Required in order for any of the military personel or pilots to be trained.

[Nicholas]

Obviously these are all reduced when ships get struck by weapons. So there would have to be a turnover.

[Mox]

Good stuff and pretty much along the lines I figured as well.
Much appriciated!

[Stevio]

Don't forget the CAG ;)

[Nicholas]

Well my thinking was that the cag isn't really trained, they're just assigned. But there will need to be a consistent character in control of the air group at points of the game.

[Voxol]

Well, BSG is a little confusing in some aspects. They got FTL drives and super-advanced technology... they should be able to produce pretty much anything from anything using nuclear fusion/fission processes... including water.

I would suggest nice and simple.

You get Ore Mine station kits, have to find asteroids or something similar, then that ore/tillium gets passed to a refinery ship, then to another ship and so on until you've got a brand new Viper!

Water I figure would be the other necessity (since its mentioned in the series) but a tough one to justify how it is obtained. Could take the easy way out and say its done by fusion/fission.

Or have a timer ticking down til water levels are low and you have to jump to a sector you know has a planet with water on it and defend the transporters (which get near the planet then simply disappear for a time whilst they collect water), along with BSG from any Cylons that show up.

Food could be generated easily on board a ship that is designated as an arboretum, though would require refined ore and water to grow in (and poop). Or could use a similar way to the water idea above where it needs to be gathered from a planet.

Later,

[Elffin]

'Deuterium' (the Earth nickname is heavy water) could be added as a ware - I'm doing some research for the Colony info (See universe references forum) and there is reference to 'Aquaria' having 'Deuterium harvesters' on its seas. It appears to be required in order for the Tylium reactors to function

[bojan]

Hi everybody!

I am a BSG and X3 fan, so I would like to share some of my thoughts with you.

Wares

I think that the wares should be closely connected with ships in your fleet. Each ship should have a specific role for survival of the whole fleet.

Here is my idea of a basic concept.

Ore, silicon: Mining ships (Majahual, Monarch). Resources: asteroids
Energy: Tylium ship (Daru Mozu). Resources: time
Food: Botanical ship (Botanical Cruiser, Kimba Huta, Cloud 9, Space Park) . Resources: energy
Labor force: Passenger ships. Resources: food
Pilots, officers, crew: Colonial One. Resources: labor force
Weapons, shields, missiles: Manufacturing ships. Resources: silicon, ore, energy, labor force.
Fighters, other ships: Flattop ship. Resources: silicon, ore, energy, labor force, pilot.

Any ship can be repaired by certain amount of crew resource, BSG should be able to repair damaged fighters.

Keep the good work!

[Elffin]

'Deuterium' (the Earth nickname is heavy water) could be added as a ware - I'm doing some research for the Colony info (See universe references forum) and there is reference to 'Aquaria' having 'Deuterium harvesters' on its seas. It appears to be required in order for the Tylium reactors to function

Are there any opinions whether it should be included? :?: just checking in order to change my planet info details! trying to make them shorter!! :)


Ok no replies : :( so I'll delete the reference!

[Admiral-Dyroi]

For the Water problem I have an easy solution...Stationary comets(Ice astroids) though that sounds stupid since astroid are primarily mineral based but hey star wars got away with it so why cant you guys?
the only problem would be the pain of adding a new skin and type of astroid
but yeah it could be mined like Tilium and uranium...and as for star ship material...Durasteel alloy or titanium alloy of some sort.

[Elffin]

Good ideas! - water is mined from a moon in the third episode of series one - hope there won't be any problems implementing that in the mod.

[Admiral-Dyroi]

Oh hey guys...dont forget the Moonshine(Crew moral boost with a minus in work output) >.o

[Nicholas]

I dont think deuterium needs to be added, and also its called heavey water because its actually deuterium oxide that we get on earth. You dont find deuterium floating around on its own, in the same way you dont find hydrogen floating around.
I dont really remember any references to deuterium, and I also dont think its really necessary.
One of the points I wanted to address was the mining of resources. I was hoping that rather than mining platforms being contained in kits, there would be a specific ship, or ships which would double up as stations. I figured it might be possible to have a station looking much like the ship, so when you told it to attach to an asteroid the ship would disappear and the station would appear on the asteroid.
Is that feasable?

[Elffin]

Thanks for the response - took 3 months for anybody to discuss Deuterium! :lol: N.b. reference was deleted in order to make the sector descriptions shorter.

In regards to mining ships - some of the Majahual type ships landed and become mines. From what I've read from official sources if the mine is a large one, other 'Majahaul ships type ships (there at least 3 in the fleet) 'join up'/connect and speed up the process. This gives us the possibility to form M L and XL type mining operations. giving us technically a mining complex.

What makes this mod different to others (hopefully) is that you can control all ships, but also the ships are basically mobile stations - each with a purpose - this would give the Commander a genuine 'gaming' reason in order to protect the fleet. i.e...
Lose a ship = slower creation of resources = slower production/repair of fighters.

I'm sure the team have many other ideas - look forward to seeing them!

[OmegaLykos]

I'm not sure if this is needed or not. But as far as food goes, I do remember an episode where the fleet's ration stock piles were poisoned or something to that effect leaving the fleet without food for awhile. Anyways long story short they came across a planet covered in algae if I remember right. They harvested it and processed it into food as I recall. I do however know for a fact that you can grow algae in space with little work compared to, say a tomato plant or any fruit or vegetable producing plant. More than likely not very tasty but food is food. Anyways just throwing that out there for you guys.

Edit: Can't Sleep so gonna add to it.

You only need two things to grow algae, water and light. More specific, shallow water or simply a moist surface. Logic would also suggest that if you can grow the algae in the shallow water and harvest it, a large portion of the water would be left behind unused. So grow the next batch in the same water and perhaps add to it if you need to. In game terms meaning you'd need more light than actual water. Light can use something similar to a power cell to power the actual lights in said ship.

That's all I got for now.

Please add spoilers in the future for those europeans that can't see that episode yet-DarkWrath

[apollo]

I think the basic food supples should be easily attainable, but theree should also be a demand for black market foods, particulalry aboard the prometheus and high ranking officials.

[Semperphi]

In history (on a ship anyway) morale has always been directly tied to the quality of the food. Find good food high morale, eat algae low morale.

Shouldn't morale be a big issue in BSG?

[bojan]

A few ideas about economy:

Basic resources (you collect or mine them)
-Water
-Ore
-Silicon
-Tylium

Intermediate commodities (are processed on ships)
-Energy and/or fuel=f(tylium, labor)
-Food = f(ore, energy, labor)
-Alloys = f(ore, energy, labor)
-Computer components =f(silicon, energy, labor)
-Weapon components =f(alloys, energy, labor)

Final products (are assembled)
-Fighters = f (alloys, computer components, energy, labor, pilot)
-Bigger ships = f(alloys, computer components, energy, labor, crew)
-Guns (weapon components, computer components, labor)
-Bullets (weapon components, tylium, labor)
-Missiles (weapon components, tylium, labor)
-Ship upgrades (computer components, labor)
-Stations f(alloys, computer components, energy, labor). Available on the final stage of game.

Special resources
-Presidential points=f(Colonial one, time, Cylons killed in battle) - can give you anything at any time.
-Credits (possible if friendly AI)

The BSG world is a story is about people:
-Citizens = their numbers increase with food, water and entertainment.
-Labor force (is generated by Citizens through time)
-Mechanics = f(citizens, time)
-Crew =f(citizens, time)
-Marines/soldiers = f(crew, time)
-Pilots = f(crew, time)

Heroes (I assume that ships are not shielded)
-Chief (boosts production, decreases repair time)
-Starbuck (always shielded, special ability - cannons kill instantly, fighters only)
-Apollo (always shielded + Command: broken formation - all fighters within range have a shield for 60 seconds, available once per hour in a game play)
-Adama (Command: Action stations – all ships are invincible for 30 seconds available once per hour in a game play)
-President (Generates presidential points - can give you anything at any time)


Ciao!

Bojan

[Theres No need to post your ideas twice in seperate threads! - Stevio]

[krm398]

Ok, water is a naturally ocurring substance, even in space. There are two posibilitys for space water. 1) harvest gases to combine to form water, its a slow process but can be done by any ship at any time. It couldnt alone save the RTF but it could add a little constantly. 2) water asteroids, better known as comets to us, of course they dont all fly around just look at the outer reaches of this solar system, the place is lousey with them just orbitting the sun at extreme range. They can be found everywhere in different quantities, and yes there will be times water will run out. This will also cause shortages of food as water is needed to produce it. Landing on a planet to get water is also a posability, but the fuel required to go land, and lift that much weight and return should be a consideration too. All things are in short supply, even people.

[krm398]

The Colonial Fleet has explored and colonized space for hundreds of years before the exodus..but we havnt considered harvesting other gases,ice from space as possible fuel for ships.(especially old ships) that might have slightly different fuel needs. If you owned an old ship and worked as a mover, its very likely it would be all modified to get by on whatever you could get the cheapest. Methane gas for instance is already known by us to exist in huge quantities in space. On some worlds in our own solar system, there are methane LAKES, huge amounts of fuel. Possibly not high performance fuels, but still emergency fuels for applications like cooling or heating ships, even helping keep the greenhouse ship a constant temerature as it moves away from suns into deep space.

[jocan2003]

For metal the black bird was made of a certain composite i dont remeber, Titanium is used on viper MK2 and MK7, as for nuclear warhead manufacturing nothing is shown on the series so in thorie we *cant* produce them.

Food yes, there is a ship that make food in the serie from nearly anything biological ( exept corpse who want to eat his buddy? ) ( no reference to any ship tho ?! )

As for water the galactica is the main water tank as it take wasted water from other ship and refine it to clear water and send it back to other ships in the fleet ( from the episode 3 or 4 first season ) When the water tank blew they said the fleet was gonna die if they dont find any water source.

[krm398]

A new idea, was just reading a report saying super strong carbon fibers are going to replace metal in some aplications soon. Its a nanotube creation made from carbon, its flexable and extremely strong, maybe carbon can be a rescourse thats needed , it could be mined from asteroids or on planets as coal. Then could be manufactuered into sheets for ship hulls .

As far as nuclear warheads goes, if the series didnt name a certain element to use we can invent any we want. It would not be going against the outline of the show, it just wasnt mentioned.

[Elffin]

Gaius Baltar requests a nuclear warhead from Adama in series 2 where he states that the plutonium will be used to make a Cylon detector. (Bastille Day)

Jocan is right that nothing in the series suggests that nuclear warheads could be created on the Galactica. It may be true also of Pegasus??

Think this provides us with an interesting debate...
http://en.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Plutonium#Familiar_Elements_and_Chemicals

Surprised so far that no one has mentioned Chamalla.....

[jocan2003]

Nothing said galactica cant produce it but there is 2 ambiguity, when gaius baltar ask for the warhead adamar said he only had 4 nuclear missile yes? and he gave one, BUT in the episode eye of jupiter when he treat about sending nuclear missile on the planet surface clearly show us 6 maybe more missile pointing at the planet surface, either way a ship in the fleet can produce them OR it has been a script error.

[Elffin]

From what I remember the Pegasus restocked Galactica.

Whether both ships could produce nuclear warheads is a debate which will probably never be confirmed.

[jocan2003]

Is it really that important? i mean, its still a game and you should not restrict the player on game feature because the serie doesnt say if we can or cant ;)

Because between game and series, in serie everything is calculated, planned and such to have a maximum thrill, but in game there is nothing planned, because anything can happen, where in the serie they may not need the Javelin NWH in game we may need it! and if we use many due to last resort, we need some way to restock it.

What can be done is a possibility or radiation leak when making these warhead, as im planning to add a *sickness and injury* factor in the crew management, could be high risk, and also severly drop moral due to the leak to balance it out ;).

Its still an improvised NWH facility :D

[Elffin]

Well, think the general feeling towards missiles have been discussed here in public somewhere... suppose its something the team will need to decide on.

http://www.thexuniverse.com/forum/showthread.php?t=447&page=5 ... post 46 onwards.

I really do like the radiation sickness idea Jocan .... reminds of an episode in season 3. This could be a constant danger/threat in systems that have nebulas O0

Any other wares that need considering guys?

i.e. Ships systems.... i.e. different range of dradis?

[krm398]

Since you mentioned ship systems, it struck me that either copper or gold is absolutely necessary to creat electronics. They need silicon for electronics too. The idea of other conducting metals being used in emergencys is possible.

[Mercer]

These should fall under "Wares"

45 MM Rounds (Vipers)
Gun Rounds (Battlestars, you will need powder to also fire the guns)
Powder packages LG (Battlestar Main Batteries)
Different types of food packages (One provides more happiness, chocolates, one provides more energy, one provides more healing abilities)
Cigarrettes (Crew Morale)
Ambrosia (Crew Morale)
Marine Equipment (Assault Rifles, Pistols, Grenades, Body Armor)
Advances Communications Equipment (Can communicate with other ships at greater ranges)
ECM systems. (For missile defense. Divided by size and effectiveness, PS if the effectiveness goes up so does the price)
Tylium (Fleet Fuel)
Tylium Ore
Iron Ore
Titanium Ore
Silver Ore
Copper Ore
Silicon
(All of those are needed in electronics, consequently smart-fire missiles, and armor, and many other things)
Generators (Power plants, can be damaged and/or destroyed. Expensive if very efficient. Needed for weapon control, heating, engine ignition power, navigational control...the works)
Engines (Again divided by size and effectiveness and now power output)
Armor (Varying thicknesses, heavier armor for battlestars, lighter for Raptors and Vipers)
CHAF missile evasion for cheap shots.
Gun Batteries for Battlestars, can be destroyed and or damaged.


More ideas as i think of them. :)