Fleet management #2

[Galder]

Content links:

Carrier tactics:

• The basics
• Bodyguards and Bombers
• Fighting M5-M6 with a small wing
• Fighting M7 with a small wing
• Fighting M1/M2 with a complete wing and yourself in a M6
• Fighting M1/M2 with a complete wing and yourself in a M1
• Basic decisions and tactics for a whole fleet

The Battle with a whole fleet:

• How to get safely in the enemy sector?
• How to command your fleet in the middle of the battle?
• How to get out of the enemy territory and emergency tactics

Well, hi there...

I'm currently doing some fighting with my carrier group. I've done this before in the original X3 and i've almost finished my fleet here in XT. I posted already some tactics in the german section and i'll try to translate it. I hope you guys can add a little bit to enhance the carrier fighting. Everything i'm writing here is just my way to play with a carrier fleet. There are several other ways to solve situations (including the use of M2 ), so please add your comments. The aim is to use something different than M2 without using Scripts (well... without most of them), and to get a different game experience. I know that it is possible to take down the whole X-verse with 4 Tyr, but i like to try that more "stylish"
If you find spelling errors and so on, i'm not used to write in english, but i'll do my very best to test you

This was my initial Post, in the original Fleet management Thread. I don't want to do some archeology here, so i started this one
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Some short tips to handle fighters.

First, keep in mind, that everything you have to manage by using the sector map is reducing your own performance in the battle. Everything that is managed just by using Hotkeys is better than using the map.

Undocking procedure for M3+ to M5 class vessel:
Make sure, that every fighter you want to use is set to Wingman. Put them into Carriers, not in 300+ M7 with only 2 docking slots. Also assign every single fighter to a carrier vessel as their homebase. You can easily give them different homebases, if you like. This doesn't matter.

To undock all fighters select a good formation on your own ship. I always use XDelta, but it's up to you. Then use the Wingman command "Protect me". Assign this command in the option menu to your keyboard. For me this is "7" on my keyboard. If i hit "7", all Wingman in the active sector are undocking and heading towards my ship. Even with your fleet moving, this command is working, because every fighter is using collision detection and the Egosoft undocking procedure.... When they are all piled up behind your ship, you can send them against the evil darkness just by hitting one key. -> Assign "Wingman attack" to a key and you only have to chose a target to unleash them

So, without using a single script, you're to undock all your fighters and send them in a massive wave to your foe. Your are also able to call them back by using the comman "Wingman protect me" again. This is handy, if your fighters are spreaded all over the sector.

Docking procedure:
Every fighter has his carrier as their homebase. Just after the battle, open the command menu and choose Call to all wingman->return to homebase. You don't have to think about M3/M6/M7blabla.... just call all your wingman, that's it. All those fighters dock by themselves and use the Egosoft procedure. This is a big advantage, because some fighters/carrier are causing trouble if an assigned groupleader docks and his copanions doesn't follow him.

If you have difficulties/crashes (not crash to desktop... only fightercrashes ) at the docking/undocking procedure, try to remove fighting scripts. There is a post in the german section, i think by Urschleim, in which crashes while undocking are described. He solved it by deinstalling the Fighting software MK3 script.

The battle:
If you fight with a whole fleet, keep in mind, that every single shot has to be displayed. This is the ultimative test for your PC Try to deactivate as many scripts as possible and don't use every single ship in your fleet. It may feel good to have 50 capships and 200 fighters in one sector... but your fps will hit a negative amount, if they try to fire all their guns And... oh yes... there will be an enemy fleet. expect them to shoot at you Their shots/bullets/textures/glows do also want to be displayed. Everything that is not needed should not be active nor in the sector. The smaller the fleet, the more fun
Try to do a xenon invasion task (the old one) to estimate how many fighters your PC is able to handle without freezing

The fighting:
Fighters are easily torn into pieces by FAA and gamma Kyons. To prevent this, always try to get the attention of the enemy by yourself. The AI is simply stupid enough to fly in a straight line into G-PPC fire. You're not. Remember, there is only 1 turret per side. The more turrets are firing at you, the longer your squadron will live if you're facing a capship or dozens of fighters heading towards your fleet.
After the initial contact set your wingman to "kill everbody in sight" This will peel of all those nasty enemy fighters from your capships. They tend to shoot at the closest enemy which is not reported as M1 or M2.

If all of your fighters are busy, this ist the time to throw in all your M7 anti-fighter craft. Don't even think about using PSG... NO!... not even alpha ones. Dumb pirates are using it... and it looks impressive. Yes, impressive, but the damage on your own shields (or those of your fighters) is absolutely deadly. Don't reduce the fight to the initial pass. PSG may do a lot of impressive damage by the first contact. But even M4 with good shielding will pass through a beta PSG wave. After this first attempt, there will be always one of your own ships in the way. You will hurt yourself. Stick to FAA/PPC/Kyon/HEPT. Your fighters should use HEPT, your capships FAA as much as possible and G-PPC for capshipannihilation. These weapons are precision weapons.

If your anti fighter M6/M7 are busy doing their thing, it is time to chose the first bigger target. This should also be the first time to open the sector map. Send your M2 to destroy their target... every thread for the real BIG artillery should be reduced to zero by now. You can also use Bombers like Kraits or Chidons to obliterate them. The main thing is, that those precious or fragile damagedealers can do their thing without being disturbed.

The usage of group hotkeys, included in 3.107, gives you a decent tool to arrange all this. You will feel every active script if 60+ ships are pumping out shots/bullets. Remember that fight at the end of the storyline? Khaak/Terran/Argon/Paranid? If this runs really smooth on your PC, than you can use some more M3s

Keep in mind that you are visiting the Khaak or Xenon with this fleet. You don't want to wipe the floor with them... you want to send them back to stoneage. Therefore you have to fight a real long time. Avoided damage and thick shields are your friend. To prevent your really expensive M2 giving a good lightshow after loosing their shields, use fighters as decoy. If you choose your M3 type stored in your carrier, take a look over his abilities first.
The ranking of abiliies should be:
1-Rudder (agility->damage avoidance, this is really the most important point. Everything with rudder under 90 should be used for specials not for the front line)
2-Shields (Everything under 125MJ is not suitable for large scale battle)
3-Firepower (you fight over time... HEPT is your friend. And look at the turrets. A Kea is by far less powerful compared to an LX in my opinion... but this dicussion could get metaphysical )
4-Speed (The faster the better, simple... this and rudder is the only defensive strategy against FAA)
5-Ship silhouette (The LONGER your ship is, the more you will get hit. It may be thin as a needle, e.g. the Falcon, but you will get hit more often than a LX or an Elite)
6-all the other things

There are more things that may be important, but these are roughly the most important ones.
To do some experimental management, get a Xenon Invasion (old one) and a carrier plus 15-20 M3 of your choice. Send all the fighters in and set them to kill everything that may honk. This is a good practice for all Admiral. One last advice... do never get near the sphere of light (in which those fighters battle) in a capship.

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The upcoming posts will cover battles in a MM6 with some escort. Advanced tactics with the use of a whole carrier group will be tested in the near future.

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[Galder]

First of all...

the main weapon of a carrier are fighters. I tested a lot, there are several different fighter types usable. Pirate Kea, Thor etc.... but when it comes down to the battle, there is nothing like the LX. It provides a nasty, compact profile, raw firepower (including B-HEPT), 100% rudder!!! and a rather high speed. This doubles, when they come into the fight in greater numbers. So i chose the LX as my main weapon, equiped with 8 A-HEPT, 2 B-HEPT, E-cells, jumpdrive and some Moskitos each.

After intense testing of large scale battles... 20 LX are doing a good job without freezing my PC.

The Carrier:
The best carrier in the game is the Pirate Galleon. Of course, the Odin is the champion of all Carriers, but you have to get the reputation first, so everything starts with a Galleon and ends with an Odin
The Galleon should be equipped with 8 B-PPC (front) 4 B-FAA (back) and 32 B-KIE for the rest. This setup will cover most of all fights. B-FAA really eat your weapon energy and are less precise than KIE, if you use them in the left/right turrets.
Next thing installed on the Galleon is a ?machine array? (don't know the english name in the game) to repair docked fighters and a superfreighter, to provide more room and the ability to buy e-cells and other things rather quickly.

The battle:

1st rule:
A carrier group is really slow. Docking and undocking are painful slowly. But if all fighters are unloaded they are able to rush every enemy in seconds. According to this, a carrier is an offensive weapon, it's weakness is defense. If you can, use P2P jumpdrive to choose your battleground. If you're ready and you've established a good formation, there will be nothing to stop you. Just jump in the sector to coordinates far away from the middle.
If you do not have P2P, get a fast M5 with jumdrive (Valkyrie) and go through the gate. On the other side, speed up and lead all those evil capships away from the gate. While you lead them away, call in your carrier, undock all fighters and the jump to the gate you just went through, dock at your carrier.
2nd rule:
Know your enemy. A Xenon Q is no challenge... but a Xenon J is a whole differnt thing. It may contain FAA and this can be deadly, if you're not ready to handle this. Try to stay as a decoy for your fighter squadron. The AI will fly in a straight line through G-PPC fire, you're able to dodge it. Normally a capship will try to point 3 Turrets at the primary target. This leaves a wide uncovered space for your fighters to do a swift strike. Try to take advantage of everything in those battles. Rockets are devastating in large numbers. AND.... rockets drain weapon energy in large numbers. A Xenon J will start fighting the rockets of the primary target. If you use wasps, you will encounter a J without weapon energy. This is handy, because your fighters don't take a high risk to run into FAA fire.
3rd rule:
Use a joystick, it's not healthy to do some fleet managing while fighting a K. You will be dead soon. If you use a joystick, you can turn and role while you give your orders in the sectormap window.
4th rule:
Deactivate scripts you don't need. The higher the fps, the higher the fun Instead of scripts, try to learn the short cuts in your menues.

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[Galder]

Bodyguards

A real carrier captain knows, that there is more than just one enemy. If you jump into Xenon sectors, you will have more than one Capship on your trail.
Every capship has his own escort. They contain M3 and M3+ and fighting them may take more time, than you can afford. Therefore you need some anti fighter M7. The best choice will be the Reaver. He is able to pump out his whole weapon energy without missing a single target. He's fast, his agility is high and he's able to use anti fighter weapons in every turret slot. 2 of them will end any fighting in seconds, after the capship has gone. With 3 GJ shields, he's also able to take some hits, if some PPC may hit him. This is the finisher, if a second capship closes in, while your fighters are busy, so you can send them to the next enemy cap, without the risk of enemy fighters stabbing their back.

Bomber:

I thought of using Chidons or Thors, but the sheer number needed to take down a capship, slows my PC to death. So i decided, here is the point where something less can be a big advantage in performance. So i took 2 Aegir with 2 front B-EMP each. They provide real good damage on a long range. Only 4 weapons ... this is a nice hing to have. Send them in shortly after you have unleashed your fighters.

The next post will cover the tactic with some LX escort while using a MM6 class vessel.

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[Galder]

This one goes to all those pilots, who love to fight in their MM6... right in the middle of the battle. You have done everything? You have annihilated capships by using your Reaper/Vidar etc.? Well, this is time consuming and annoying if anything happens which wasn't planned.

Did you ever notice that those annoying M3 are draining more shield energy after you have killed their mothership without taking a single hit? This is the point where M3/M3+ really do damage. They are outnumbering your beloved Tyr/Phoenix/whatever. Even the player can not dodge everything, how much damage will the AI suffer instead, if you send your fighters in? A lot, thats certain.

For the first time, produce and equip 10 LX as described above. Then choose a fighter or a MM6 for yourself and equip it with hard hitting weapons, like B-HEPT or A-PPC. There's no need for PAC or pulse weapons, we'll go for something bigger. Personally, i prefer a Reaper with 12 B-HEPT and 2 A-PPC. Good firepower and a really fast MM6 which matches the speed of our escort, those 10 LX. Put 50 e-cells in your cargobay and get some Typhoons and Wasps in the rest of the free cargospace. If every fighter is stored in your carrier, choose Cyclones Fury (North Gate) as your jumpdrive target and hit the energy button. The first few fighter patrol will fall to your anti fighter weapons on your carrier. Fly a little bit away from the north gate while fighting and turn the nose of your ship (hopefully the Galleon) towards the gate. Stay in 2 km range to the gate. We want to give unwanted visitors to this sector a warm welcome with some B-KIE or B-FAA.

If there are 2 or 3 pirate fighters left and the Galleon is placed (the LX must be able to dock without an obstacle) You can undock all 10 LX.
You should have switched them to wingman and have assigned a hotkey for the 2 commands "Wingman->protect me" and "Wingman->attack my target"
This is the point where the real show begins. Switch to the outside view and hit "Wingman->protect me". The undocking procedure is something special in my opinion. You undock the pure death. 8 fighters are undocking at once and are swinging in position, two will follow.
It's time to place yourself in your Reaper and call your LX "Wingman->protect me" after you are undocked and clear. Just for the fun... try the formation XDelta. This will give the most impressive results and has also some bonus.

You may have experienced the feeling in a real BIG capship. Heavy shielded and armed with the most powerful weapons you feel like the emperor of the Universe. There is no force in the X-verse to stop you. Ok, a MM6 is no real match to a M2... but you're not alone. If all those LX are in Formation around you, you will feel dangerous. There are 80 A-Hept and 20 B-HEPT (excluding your own) around you to unleash their firepower on the designated aim. You just have to choose one. Extremly special, i love it.
Look around a little bit, there should be some fighters on the map... this is the first test object. Fly carefully towards them stop at a distance of 5 km, select one and hit "Wingman->attack my target" The show gets hot. 10 LX will pass your ship while nearing those poor pirates. You will see a real halo of green laserfire raining some millisezuras on the first enemy before he will explode. Then set your Wingman to kill everything in sight and snigger a bit. The rest won't last long and your LX are finishing them in some seconds. You won't be hit, your fighters don't have even slightly damaged shields.

Why?
You use XDelta and the AI tends to attack the nearest enemy. They don't notice the LX. This is fighter vs fighter specific.

The next test objectis already in 7 km range... another 4 fighter group. Gather your LX in formation and head towards the next enemies. The show wil get a little bit hot now. You are about to take part in the battle. Remember, you are flying a MM6... not a M3, your ship is BIGGER. At a distance of 4 Km hit your attack button and wait until the first 4 LX are appering on your HUD. This ist crucial. If you begin to dance around with your MM6 with all of your LX behind you, you will get hurt. This is why:
http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/8568/flotte4uw2.jpg
There is a LX docked at my Reaper and as you can see, the first 4 LX in formation are really not far away. You will crush them if you do some weird maneuvres. So let them get some metres ahead, before you accelerate. Also keep in mind, the AI don't use the speed booster. Accelerate moderatly and avoid crashes.

Proceed towards the enemy fighters and pump energy in the first one until it's gone. You'll find yourself in a tunnel of green laserlight, ending in just oner point. Now the real important thing is.... If you're in a dark tunnel... KEEP AWAY FROM THE LIGHT! Don't fly through the last postion of your enemy ... there are 6 LX BEHIND you... filled with wild pilots swearing like a Cheltboy, while fring their HEPT. You will lose a lot shield energy if you pass the crossing laser rays. Keep your bastu away and set them to kill everything and the fight is over in seconds.

No screenshot can catch the intense fire in fighter battles. Did you ever fly a XI in a M3? This is much more intense. The fire is not streaming towards you, but towards your enemies, you're truly commanding a deadly force.

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[Galder]

After the first few tests, we're ready to go for something bigger. The most deadly force you will encounter in Cyclones Fury are Reavers. They can tear down every fighter force without proper preparation in a mizura.

How do we deal with FAA and KIE?
The ideal situation is... the Reaver is targetting the player ship. We kept our precious Wasps and Typhoons. At a distance of 15 km we stop and wait without moving. If the Reaver is 14 km away, we begin to fire swarm rockets in a constant stream. The Reaver wil notice this and start his anti missile fire. This is draining a huge amount of weapon energy, especially Reavers are really pumping out everything they have against your missiles. Perfect.
When he's 7 km away, his weapon energy is low. At a distance of 6 km, you hit "Wingman->Attack my target" wait, until the first 4 LX appear in front of you and accelerate.
The Reaver will always fire his B-PPC first, usind the last amount of weapon energy... at a distance of 2,5 km your ships will open fire and the hell turns up.
This is the ultimate fighting experience. Absolutely dense. You're dodging B-PPC fire while flying through the green tunnel of death, ending on the shields of the Reaver. One step in the wrong direction and there will be not enough left to fill a small box. You may shout "Hail to the Split!" and hit the fire button. Your 12 B-HEPT are streaming green fire towards the Reaver...
You're so fast, you will allmost crash into his shields... you're dodging fire 50 m above the hull of the Reaver, and the A-PPC is pounding on the rest of his shields. After the intial pass you turn around and you will see this:
http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/9987/flotte2mc6.jpg

This was shot after the inital pass of 11 LX and myself in a Thor MKII. 10 LX are able to dish out around 3 GJ of damage in just 3-4 sezuras. Well... this is the time to take screenshots, otherwise you're only able to take some photograph of the lovely scenery and some crates.
BUT!! never let the Reaver turn around, he will have B-FAA in his mouth, and this will hurt! Take him down, don't let your fingers get off the trigger.
The battle is over some seconds after you turned around.
Carracks are spacedust after the first attack, Galleons will have lost more than the half of their shields.
The rest of the enemy escort is just a little chill out.
I never lost a LX if everything went like it was planned. If some LX take hulldamage because of FAA try to protect him when the escort starts to fire.

If the Reaver is heading towards a LX instead of the playership, you have to be well prepared. Fly towards the enemy in a straight line at high speed. A tight and perfect formation is absolutely critical. If a LX is only 300m ahead, it will be killed. Release as much Typhoons as you can, fire until your guns begin to glow. The aim is to have 5 of 10 fighters to fire at the same moment. The AI has the same problems of target determinating as the player. If enough fighters are firing, the AI tries to determine the greatest threat over and over. It cannot concentrate it's whole firepower on one target, so it's busy switching targets and the damage is dealt between different LX. This will keep your LX alive. The primary target will be hit by B-PPC fire, but it can soak up some hits while changing its flight path... in these seconds you're able to tear down the shields of the Reaver. He will be a little bit angry about this

Of course, you can use the Otas turret jammer, but this kind of fighting is so intense, it's hard to describe this. Ships like Carracks, Ps, Qs, Marauders are no challenge. Especially Qs are spacedust in a solid form. The next tests will cover Xenon Ks and Js, but i have to earn some money to buy some equipment and support.

I'd really like to see which tactics you use in fights like this. I posted this also in the german section, but there seems to be noone having done something similar before. So i hope to find some differnent carrier tactics here.

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[cain'blood]

Galder, thanks for all that info, it'll help me a lot.
So many questions answered and I didn't even have to ask

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[Anon loyalist]

Nice work mate

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[Aragon Speed]

Well done. Very useful.

Added to the X-Tended Mod Index.

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[Galder]

Erm.... this is not completed yet.

I've currently finished my Carrier Group containing only M7 (1 Galleon, 2 Aegir, 2 Reaver, 2 Asgard, 20 LX and the Aran). I'm very busy testing this setup. I think, i have to reduce this group, it's simply to heavily armed for normal Xenon sectors. The Asgards don't fight, they provide only P2P jumpdrive. As far as i can see, i won't buy a Tyr in the next time, although i have the terran rep Js don't last longer than 45 seconds, if everything runs very smooth.

There are some positioning issues with the Aegirs and the functions of the GHK, provided by the 3.106 Bonuspack. They mess up my formation or tend to attack to early. If anybody has some experience with M7 and the GHK tool, feel free to post I'm really a little bit stuck here. It works fine with M2/M1, but M7 seems to be a little bit to fast for correct positioning.

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[Aragon Speed]

Just because it isn't finished is no reason why it shouldn't get the recognition it deserves. Even in it's current state you can see the time and effort you have put into this, and it is already useful to other members.

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