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    Thread: Killing Xenon Ks and Khak with a Panther

    1. #1
      TXU Jr. Member Pirate's Bane's Avatar
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      Default Killing Xenon Ks and Khak with a Panther

      This continues where the thread Best M-6 Weapons Load Out Revisited left off.

      Based on various comments by others I was going to do 2 things.

      1. Kill a K with my Heavy Dragon loaded out with 4 CIGs by finding the weak side of the K, and by staying near a station that I could “docking computer into” whenever the heat got to hot.
      2. I was considering buying a Boron Thresher, loading it with PPCs, and gunning the K while outside of its weapon range.

      So what happened?

      1. First I tried to take the K down with my Heavy Dragon. After several shish kabobbings, I decided I was no way near patient enough to take a K down this way. The 4 CIGs couldn’t deal enough damage to take the K’s shields down in a reasonable period of time.
      2. Next I considered purchase of a Thresher. I decided against this idea due to the fact that many people complained about its size and horrible performance under AI control.
      3. So a new idea struck. Load out my recently purchased Panther and have a go at the K using the same method I tried with the Heavy Dragon.
      4. After a few tries gone wrong, I took the K down by using the Thresher method of staying outside the K’s gun range and by trying to stay away from its main guns.
      Basically, I approached the K within 5 Km and cut my engines. When the K reached a range of 4.6 KM my front turret began firing the 6 CIGs. At a range of 3 -3.5 Km the K opened up on my Panther. I increased power and tried to stay away from its main guns. At about 2 Km I turned the Panther around and then the rear turret would fire on the K. Rinse and repeat 3 times and the K was history and the Panther still had 60% shields.

      Now I know what you are thinking, “How exactly do CIGs have a range of 4.6 Km?” Aha! I certainly do not know. The CIGs stated range is about 3.4 Km. (which it always was in my Dragon) so unless the ship’s engineer tweaked the guns, I can’t explain this.

      Next I would like to explain my “hide inside a station” method of dealing with a mass of Khak.

      Accepting the defend station mission in my Heavy Dragon I was soon up against 7 Khak Corvettes and I do know how much small junk – at least 20. As you know the life expectancy of a lone M-6 is quite short under these conditions, so I tried the “hang out near a station and use the docking computer when things got tough idea”.

      After running in the station 2 or 3 times with close to 20% shields, I realized I needed a new tactic. So I undocked my Heavy Dragon and I decided I would just sit there and see if there was some way I could take down some of these Khak to at least have a fighting chance.
      Well while I’m sitting there the Corvettes decide they are going to come under the lip of the station and root me out. Not knowing what else to do, I open up on the first Corvette that comes near, he keeps coming and I turn him into space dust. Rinse and repeat, I just sit there, they keep trying to get at me and I keep shooting them down. They can’t missile me, and they can’t get behind me, and they don’t give up.

      Now you would think that the station was firing away at the Khak while all this was going on? As far as I could tell it was not firing at all. It must have cut some kind of deal with them.
      Anyway, realizing I had the situation well in hand I decided to call the Panther in to pitch clean up on the remaining 3 Corvettes and assorted other stuff.
      It was very impressive to watch the Panther mowing everything down. I think if I had a proper gun load out in it, it could have taken them all down from the beginning. Anyway, it was a blast winning the battle and I can really see the usefulness of the Panther.

      -- Long Live the Fighters!! --

    2. #2
      Spammy the (spacefl)Eye in the sky... stemardue's Avatar
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      Thanks PB!

      Nice one, cool descriptions of the tactics and good form, even cool to read for fun. - You should put together your 'experiences' and make a sort of 'captain journal' if you are so inclined.

      About the extra range of the guns, that happened already with some ships even in X3R, I can't explain why (maybe some other techno-guru can) but with some large ships and some turret placements, the firing range was like spanned from the tip of the ship versus ship center (i guess), so you could stay out of enemy firing range and beating em up even using their same weapons... sort of a technical bug/inconsistency i'd say.

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    3. #3
      TXU Jr. Member Pirate's Bane's Avatar
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      I'm glad you liked the post. I wish that bug was on the M6s too! Does anyone else know of any other bugged gun ranges? This is important info for us crazy fighters.

      Last edited by Pirate's Bane; 08-07-2009 at 03:31 PM.
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    4. #4
      TXU New Member Yezariael's Avatar
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      that is the advantage of the phoenix (in x3 reunion... but as well in tc). this ship is quite huge and the front turret is quite far away from the center of the ship... and that's the advantage. the turrets open fire when the center of the rival ship is in their range... and the distance is calculated between the turrets position and the center of the target. the front turret of the phoenix is maybe 1-2 km away from its center. if the rival ship is smaller (something like a xenon k or in best case a kha'ak destroyer) the phoenix has at least da range advantage of 1km.

      I hope this was understandable... my english is not that good :P

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    5. #5
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      Your english is way better than my German! Anyway, this is a very interesting thing that really makes an impact on large ship selection. I wonder if it affects the Thresher with PPCs!!

      Last edited by Pirate's Bane; 08-07-2009 at 03:44 PM.
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      TXU New Member Yezariael's Avatar
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      Even if the Thresher is as large as a titan it is not large enough. Also the guns aren't placed at the front. Every commonwealth M2 (including Xenon und Terran) would kick its ass. Only the Kha'ak GKS are small enough and have a too short weapon range, so you have a good chance to kill them.

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      I guess we should put you down as someone who definately does not like the Thresher??
      That Thresher is certainly a love it or hate it ship.

      -- Long Live the Fighters!! --

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      Pirates Bane, you have to watch this video clip, this is what I was talking about when I said get in close, the video shows lots of nifty places you can get to almost inside the K. You can pretty much take out a K with your pocket knife from this distance! Just watch out for it turning.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3QIM...eature=related

      Have no idea what the text says, not sure if there is a translated version floating around. Hats off to this guy though, thats my kinda flying! Who needs a Thresher!!!!


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      Quote Originally Posted by Yezariael View Post
      Even if the Thresher is as large as a titan it is not large enough. Also the guns aren't placed at the front. Every commonwealth M2 (including Xenon und Terran) would kick its ass. Only the Kha'ak GKS are small enough and have a too short weapon range, so you have a good chance to kill them.
      wut?

      the thresher has a 10 main gun battery in the front that can house the 2 most strongest weapons in the game (PPC and IC)

      theres -no- way any ship can take that kind of firepower to the side

      also its only a range advantage if the projectile was fast enough to hit or if you got the "drop" on the opponent

      @ cellestial

      thats easy to do in an M3 class ship, its small enough to pull that off :P M7s are just too big and rather unshapely to do that sortof stuff


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      TXU Full Member cellestial's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Catra View Post
      wut?

      the thresher has a 10 main gun battery in the front that can house the 2 most strongest weapons in the game (PPC and IC)

      theres -no- way any ship can take that kind of firepower to the side

      also its only a range advantage if the projectile was fast enough to hit or if you got the "drop" on the opponent

      @ cellestial

      thats easy to do in an M3 class ship, its small enough to pull that off :P M7s are just too big and rather unshapely to do that sortof stuff
      Have heard a few people say the PPC and IC are the most powerful weapons in the game, but on paper the PSP does far more damage, do the others have a far greater rate of fire? Range appears to be the same.

      I have one Osaka set up with PSP's in the front and right batteries, it will shred anything large from 8km, as long as the AI doesn't mess up, dropped it in on a Hoshi and Akuma just last night, front battery oppened up on the Hoshi and the right bettery on the Akuma, they didn't last more than about 15-20 secs.

      The link post was more a continuation of a discussion Pirate Bane and I had on his previous post on M6 load-outs which led to this one about the Xenon killing Panther. You can do this in pretty much anything smaller than an M7 as long as your weapons can do more damage than the shield recharge rate. Not sure if there is an M7 nimble enough to surf a K2?

      I think the point Yezariel was making is where the weapons are in relation to where the computer deems the mid poin of your ship to be, I think it is more about where you sit in the physical layout of the ship but thats just from observation, with something like an Osaka, the front turrets are actually way out in front of where you sit in the ship, between 1 and 2 km. I have swatted M3's and M6's with the front of the Osaka that were 1.4km away in fact find it the easiest way to get rid of a wave of Khak corvettes. The Threshers front weapons array is at the physical front of the ship but not stuck way out in front of where the pilot sits so you don't get the added range advantage.


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